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Setting up a family "Mineral Rights" Trust. Advice???

by , Posted to on 05/08/2012 8:44 PM | "Quote" | "Quick Reply" |

Joined: 12/16/2001
Location: ND
My Dad's family owns the mineral rights on some acreage in the Bakken. No one has been contacted about leasing the rights and I believe the reason is that the "Land Men" have looked at it - seen how complicated it could get and stepped away.
I believe that if there was a "go-to" person that represented this group of people it would shed a completely different "light" on the subject and everyone in the family could thus benefit from some lease income. The neighboring land is all leased.

Does anyone have any ideas or suggestions as to how to get this done? Is it expensive (since I probably be the one to "flip the bill")? What is commonly done? Someone within the family be the spokesman????

I am sure an attorney has to set this up - how do you find one in the Minot area that doesn't already have retainers by the oil companies? Or doesn't that matter?

Any comments would be greatly appreciated.
Re: Setting up a family "Mineral Rights" Trust. Advice???
by on 05/08/2012 8:55 PM | Reply #1 | "Quote" | "Quick Reply" |

Joined: 07/14/2003
Location: ND
 I will see if my dad can offer advice. Our family has them split a million ways. Should try to keep in a trust like you said. Invest those dollars in land and other real estate. 

Then you get the good effect. 




 
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Re: Setting up a family "Mineral Rights" Trust. Advice???
by on 05/08/2012 9:04 PM | Reply #2 | "Quote" | "Quick Reply" |

Joined: 02/28/2008
Location: ND
I am a Landman and the fact that it's complicated doesn't really mean anything. If a company wants to lease your land they will. It's not up to a Landman to say its too difficult to do, that's up to the oil company. If we walked away from any title that seems difficult then we wouldn't have a whole lot of work because there are all kinds of clouded title out there.

I would definitely contact an attorney that you trust and tell them what you want done. If you put it in a trust and list yourself as a "spokesman" (trustee) that might straighten things out but whatever attorney you get would have to figure out and clean up any confusion and record it in the courthouse. I would reccomend an attorney that deals with oil and gas as you could find any attorney to do what you want to do but If I were you I would find one with oil and gas law experience. Just like anything else, if you hire one to do work without oil and gas experience you might be disappointed. I look at it like if you are hiring a mechanic to work on your car you would want one that has experience with cars and you wouldnt hire a boat mechanic to do it. Hope this helps a little.
 

Re: Setting up a family "Mineral Rights" Trust. Advice???
by on 05/08/2012 10:04 PM | Reply #3 | "Quote" | "Quick Reply" |

Joined: 01/09/2002
Location: ND
Marbleyes is 100% correct on all counts.  Just bite the bullet and seek out an attorney to help you and your family navigate the process.  They will set it up as you wish within the law.

BTW, there are more vehicles out there to consolidate the holdings under one roof for ease of management.  A trust is only one of them, any attorney worth their salt should also take you through the decision making process of which is correct for your scenario.  It may be a trust, a limited liability partnership, a limited liability corporation, or even their cousins the limited liability, limited partnership/corporation.

It really isn't that horribly expensive.

I'd suggest, as marbleyes did that there is another reason the oil companies haven't been interested in those acres as of yet.  Maybe on the margin of what is currently thought to be economic????

Search the archives at:  http://groups.google.com/group/bakken-shale-discussion?pli=1

Lots of interesting info available on that forum.
“Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it.” ~ Mark Twain
Re: Setting up a family "Mineral Rights" Trust. Advice???
by on 05/10/2012 6:15 PM | Reply #4 | "Quote" | "Quick Reply" |

Joined: 12/16/2001
Location: ND
Thank You for the information.   Now, if I could just get a Minot attorney to return my phone call................
Re: Setting up a family "Mineral Rights" Trust. Advice???
by on 05/10/2012 7:59 PM | Reply #5 | "Quote" | "Quick Reply" |

Joined: 10/27/2004
Location: ND
Good luck. I hope you don't end up in a family pissing match.
"The only enemy of guns is rust and politicians."
"The best defense against usurpatory government is an assertive citizenry."

William F. Buckley, Jr.
"Unarmed helplessness is for sheep and the French."  Ted Nugent

"The beauty of the second amendment is that it will not be needed until they try to take it."
 -Thomas Jefferson


The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government.
-Thomas Jefferson




Re: Setting up a family "Mineral Rights" Trust. Advice???
by on 05/10/2012 11:20 PM | Reply #6 | "Quote" | "Quick Reply" |

Joined: 01/08/2004
Location: ND
 
cynical Said:
Good luck. I hope you don't end up in a family pissing match.
Why do you always have to be so cynical? 

IT IS BETTER TO ASK FOR FORGIVENESS THAN ASK FOR PERMISSION!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Re: Setting up a family "Mineral Rights" Trust. Advice???
by on 05/11/2012 07:10 AM | Reply #7 | "Quote" | "Quick Reply" |

Joined: 03/12/2009
Location: nd
If you go the route of a trust, make sure it is "REVOCABLE".

We are dealing with the consequences of bad advice on an "irrevocable" family trust..

Freedom Finacial in Minot seems to understand these things and have attorneys to set up whatevr you would wish.
Re: Setting up a family "Mineral Rights" Trust. Advice???
by on 05/11/2012 08:53 AM | Reply #8 | "Quote" | "Quick Reply" |

Joined: 10/27/2004
Location: ND
simmsjs Said:
 
cynical Said:
Good luck. I hope you don't end up in a family pissing match.
Why do you always have to be so cynical? 

That's just my nature.   I've seen and heard of many family pissing matches over oil money in the last few years.   Lots of envy out there.

"The only enemy of guns is rust and politicians."
"The best defense against usurpatory government is an assertive citizenry."

William F. Buckley, Jr.
"Unarmed helplessness is for sheep and the French."  Ted Nugent

"The beauty of the second amendment is that it will not be needed until they try to take it."
 -Thomas Jefferson


The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government.
-Thomas Jefferson




Re: Setting up a family "Mineral Rights" Trust. Advice???
by on 05/11/2012 09:54 AM | Reply #9 | "Quote" | "Quick Reply" |

Joined: 02/11/2002
Location: ND
I think that was meant as a joke.
Johnny 7
Re: Setting up a family "Mineral Rights" Trust. Advice???
by on 05/11/2012 09:58 AM | Reply #10 | "Quote" | "Quick Reply" |

Joined: 12/19/2001
Location: ND

I find this topic interesting.  I am employed as a Trust Officer, which basically means I work with estate planning and settlement, various types of investment accounts, various retirement accounts as well as act as trustee for various types of accounts including Mineral Trust accounts.

You are on the right track in looking for an attorney.  My advice is do not settle for just any attorney, find someone who specializes in these types of issues.  The document they write could be in effect for a number of years to come and there is nothing worse than a poorly written document.  If a trust is the avenue you choose consider hiring a trustee to administer the trust.  It is true you can appoint whoever you wish as the trustee, but trust accounts can be very hands on and unfortunatley if not adminstered properly may not do what was initially intended.

As far as revocable or irrevocable.  It depends on each individual or family situation.   I won't get into that on here.  I will however say they each have their place.

To get started on this however a properly written document is where you start.  I could go on for pages and pages, but if you have any specific questions please feel free to send me a message and I will try to help you out.
 

Re: Setting up a family "Mineral Rights" Trust. Advice???
by on 05/11/2012 10:33 AM | Reply #11 | "Quote" | "Quick Reply" |

Joined: 02/18/2004
Location: ND
fourwinns Said:
Thank You for the information.   Now, if I could just get a Minot attorney to return my phone call................
Thats the same problem we have here in Dickinson, however it is effecting all business'. I cant get an electrician, hydro seeding guy, siding company, mechanic, etc. The constant reponse is "we will put you on the list and get back to you"

The lawn seeding guy has had me on his list since last August, still a dirt front yard


LINDY FISHING



Re: Setting up a family "Mineral Rights" Trust. Advice???
by on 05/11/2012 1:17 PM | Reply #12 | "Quote" | "Quick Reply" |

Joined: 01/25/2012
Location: mn
contact the law firm of  Due-We Cheatm and How.  First appointment is free, second appointment costs you everything!
Re: Setting up a family "Mineral Rights" Trust. Advice???
by on 05/11/2012 1:22 PM | Reply #13 | "Quote" | "Quick Reply" |

Joined: 07/14/2003
Location: ND
I'm just saying stay away from splitting the minerals up.  It is stupid in my opinion.  If there was a big "slush" fund where all minerals went to, there is then the ability to use that pool to invest in "real" engines.

I see it way too much how minerals are split lots of ways.  All a person gets is enough to pay a cell phone bill a month.  But if it were put in a slush bucket and used to purchase something real, soon you have a flower blooming.

Otherwise, it is just a patch of dandelions.




 
Kirsch's Outdoor Products | Fargo, ND | 701-261-9017 Garmin GPS Hunting Maps
Liebel's Guide Service | Williston, ND | 701-770-6746 liebelsguideservice.com
Jig-em-Up Guide Service | Grand Forks, ND | 701-739-9198 jig-em-up-guide-service.com

 
Re: Setting up a family "Mineral Rights" Trust. Advice???
by on 05/11/2012 10:41 PM | Reply #14 | "Quote" | "Quick Reply" |

Joined: 03/12/2009
Location: nd
fishhook Said:

I find this topic interesting.  I am employed as a Trust Officer, which basically means I work with estate planning and settlement, various types of investment accounts, various retirement accounts as well as act as trustee for various types of accounts including Mineral Trust accounts.

You are on the right track in looking for an attorney.  My advice is do not settle for just any attorney, find someone who specializes in these types of issues.  The document they write could be in effect for a number of years to come and there is nothing worse than a poorly written document.  If a trust is the avenue you choose consider hiring a trustee to administer the trust.  It is true you can appoint whoever you wish as the trustee, but trust accounts can be very hands on and unfortunatley if not adminstered properly may not do what was initially intended.

As far as revocable or irrevocable.  It depends on each individual or family situation.   I won't get into that on here.  I will however say they each have their place.

To get started on this however a properly written document is where you start.  I could go on for pages and pages, but if you have any specific questions please feel free to send me a message and I will try to help you out.
 

It also depends on each individual or family situation NEVER changing.

It you are 100% sure that will never happen????????



Re: Setting up a family "Mineral Rights" Trust. Advice???
by on 05/12/2012 06:34 AM | Reply #15 | "Quote" | "Quick Reply" |

Joined: 07/14/2003
Location: ND
Gst,

Heck no!




 
Kirsch's Outdoor Products | Fargo, ND | 701-261-9017 Garmin GPS Hunting Maps
Liebel's Guide Service | Williston, ND | 701-770-6746 liebelsguideservice.com
Jig-em-Up Guide Service | Grand Forks, ND | 701-739-9198 jig-em-up-guide-service.com

 
Re: Setting up a family "Mineral Rights" Trust. Advice???
by on 05/12/2012 07:30 AM | Reply #16 | "Quote" | "Quick Reply" |

Joined: 02/28/2007
Location: ND
gst Said:
If you go the route of a trust, make sure it is "REVOCABLE".

We are dealing with the consequences of bad advice on an "irrevocable" family trust..

Freedom Finacial in Minot seems to understand these things and have attorneys to set up whatevr you would wish.
our family's irrevocable trust didn't have a problem revoking it. 

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Posted On: 05/08/2012 8:44 PM
1859 Views, 16 Comments

Tags: rights, family, mineral, setting, advice, one, land, believe, dad, men
More Tags: oil, attorney, spokesman,
Region: Minnesota

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